I just bought a 2005 Cobalt LS about a month ago, i hate the SS with a passion. l already want to modify it enough to beat those losers that actually drive those things.

what are people doing for modifications with intake, header, exhaust.
Also, has anyone tried installing a jet performance chip?

anyone got any other ideas for mods, without a turbo or nitrous?

Thanks

Clicky
Clicky Clicky
Clicky Clicky Clicky

I'm sure that can help ya get started.

The SS is supercharged, so You will need some form of forced induction or nitrous to beat them.

Is the LS the standard 2.2 ecotec or the VVT2.4?

2.2 is 65hp less than the SS.
2.4 is 35hp less than SS.

i have the 2.2L ecotec, dont think there was a 2005 cobalt offered with the 2.4L.

i realize that this is 65 hp difference, maybe i should have been more specific.

i would like to know what modifications are available for the cobalt and what modifications are available for the other cars running the same engine that will work on the cobalt. i am not necessarily asking how to bring up my hp and torque to beat an SS

i realize that these will not bring me 65 hp up but trust me, theres a method to my madness....

Obviously the best way to gain gobs of power is from Forced Induction because don't expect to beat an SS while being Naturally Aspirated. Although it would be cool beating one while N/S I doubt it will happen.....yet.....

Here is a great thread for 2.2 ecotec mods....


http://www.j-body.org/forums/read.php?f=2&i=318797&t=318797

hmm do i sense a little hostility tords the small eaton supercharger sitting under the ss's Hood.
If you want bash those guys into the ground your going to need boost or juice like Alex said
How do you feel about vortech superchargers?
www.rsmracing.com

not so much hostile against the supercharger itself. im just irate that GM puts the supercharger in the same car that they put the rice wing on.

My car has all the same entertainment features that the 2005 SS has, it might be different now that the 2006's are out.

I have run through some calcs to compare my car to the SS, i need some torque but not any gross changes to beat them off the line (top speed isnt going to be the issue, acceleration to approx 90 mph is).

I will eventually go the forced induction route, but for now i am interested in all parts that are available/will work on the car keeping forced induction in mind.

These include (some of which i have already found but wouldnt mind hearing a review):
-pistons
-rods
-crankshaft
-intake manifold and air filter
-camshafts
-cam gears
-valve springs
-racing block
-ignition
-fuel system
-onboard computer (maybe custom)
-clutch upgrade
-cooling system
-differential
-modification for AWD/RWD

I want to keep the car drivable, and keep it looking stock, aiming for approx 185 hp without forced induction.

If you put all of that stuff on your car you'll have way more than 185 hp, you can get 190 fairly simple with just two exhaust and two intake mods. I dont know exactly what quality of upgrade you plan on giving to all of those parts, but with all of that you'll be beating most $40-50,000 sportscars with ease. Also, if you put top dollar mods of all of those my guess is you wouldnt be street legal.

Also I wanted to mention, if you add cold air intake, throttle spacer, ceramic headers, aftermarket 3" exhaust, and put on light 18 " wheels and a light carbon fiber hood, you can beat an ss without nos or forced air. I've done it several times.

I am still thinking in the way of forced induction eventually, actually maybe sooner than originally thought.
I just picked up GM's sport compact performance book, this thing is great....1400hp out of a cobalt (Non SS)

Ok, ok, that little list of mine above has grown...i might as well be building the car up from the ground as drive train upgrades will probably be necessary.

But for now, i might as well get a few mods for the stock car.

I am looking for a header that will require no major fabrication, preferrably 4-2-1. Do any fit on my somewhat stock cobalt 2.2L?

Travis Kearney wrote:Also I wanted to mention, if you add cold air intake, throttle spacer, ceramic headers, aftermarket 3" exhaust, and put on light 18 " wheels and a light carbon fiber hood, you can beat an ss without nos or forced air. I've done it several times.

Haha.Yeah your car that probably puts out 145 hp at the most to the wheels Versus a car that puts out 200 hp to the wheels. I wonder who will win.
Also the ss has upgraded suspension, I think brakes, and I think 5 lugs.

Quote:

Haha.Yeah your car that probably puts out 145 hp at the most to the wheels Versus a car that puts out 200 hp to the wheels. I wonder who will win.

First i want to state that i dont believe the numbers that people are claiming to get from stock SS's and them being greater than those stated by GM, nor will i believe it until i actually see it on a dyno myself. So i am going to do this comparison using the numbers posted by GM at the crank.

Now, lets clarify, to beat an SS, i am not going to need to modify my top speed, i am going to need to increase my acceleration.

lets compare the stock 2005 SS with my stock 2005 LS.
Cobalt LS -145hp, 155lb-ft, 15 inch wheels (overall dia - approx 24 ")
Cobalt SS - 205hp, 200lb-ft, 18 inch wheels (overall dia - approx 25.5")

according to the laws of physics:
-torque = force * length (or tire radius in our case)
-force = mass * acceleration

25.5/24 *100% = 106.25%
which means that the SS has 6.25% and needs 6.25 % more torque to accelerate at the same rate as the LS.
so the torque needed to match the SS with 15 inch tires would be:
200lb-ft/1.0625 = 188 lb-ft of torque

So, correct me if i am wrong but i have heard that the weapon R intake gives 7hp and 17lb-ft of torque...this will probably be my first modification.
155lb-ft +17lb-ft = 172lb-ft

that means that i have 16 lb-ft that needs to be gained by adding bolt ons:
-header
-cat back exhaust
-fuel system upgrade

The only other catch here is the tire width, assuming i am using my 15 inch tire, i would need a wider tire to match traction of the tires offered on the SS.

Considering i had mentioned several mods above that would have been substantial adders that you were basing your comments on, i dont think travis is wrong.
However, like i said, it seems more feasable to build an engine from scratch, maybe even an entire car.

I have personally seen a redline dyno. 200 hp. Believe it or not, that is what they put out. STOCK.

And this bench racing thing, you can't say if you add this and that, you'll have 172 ft lbs of torque.

The only difference between the eco in the balts and the cav/fire is the electric psp.
So they figure 5 extra hp.
With an intake and exhaust I put down 141 hp and 140 tq. To the wheels.

Now compare that to a stock ss. 200>141+balts 5 hp. Then you factor in the weight of the cars. Cobalts weigh more than the older j's.

Sunfires rule! (Tom) wrote:I have personally seen a redline dyno. 200 hp. Believe it or not, that is what they put out. STOCK.

Not only that, but they put out 200+hp at the wheels!

Ta, Paul.

ok please note for the above, i was referring to torque, not horsepower.
and tom, i have seen your replies to my other posts and i will repeat my original statement: i dont believe the numbers that people are claiming to see from stock SS's and them being greater than those stated by GM, nor will i believe it until i actually see it on a dyno myself.

now i typed in "chevy cobalt dyno" into my search engine and clicked on the first link with someone who has only put on an intake, he got 187hp and 172 lb-ft of torque at the wheels. i have also seen ppl posting numbers much higher in the past as well, who to believe?

as far as weight is concerned, the stock 2005 SS weighs less than 100 lbs more than my car so i assumed it to be negligent (assumed them to be equal). as for the rest of what i have stated, this was a mathematical proof so if you would like to prove me wrong, i would suggest getting a physics text book cause this is based on basic physics principles.

The GM numbers are numbers at the crank, for both engines. also i saw no torque numbers in your reply. if you are getting 200 at the wheels, what was the torque? there are two factors for determining the output power of any rotational drive, torque and rpm. again i need torque, and not as much of it as people think. This is my point.

as far as gains go for the intake, were they right? have you found a different number that you can throw in there, cause if you re-read the above you will see that i was unsure about the gains for a cobalt. The point i was trying to make here is that you took what someone else said and shot it down and i am tired of reading your posts when all you want to do is call people out without acknowledging what they have to say.

and for horsepower numbers put out at the wheels, post all the dyno results you want, i have heard that the SS has dyno'ed anywhere from 187 hp to 260 hp stock, thats quite the difference. conveniently enough i have a friend who is considering buying an SS, so i may actually see it for myself.

here's the bottom line: you were trying to attack someone elses opinion and i can guarantee that he is a lot closer to right here than you are. there will be one simple proof done, my car will be modified (longer term with the parts listed above), i will race it and may even post it if i win, just so i can have little know it all whiners like yourself calling it bull.

Now the point to this post, what parts are available for the aftermarket of the cobalt that arent listed above somewhere.

CK wrote:ok please note for the above, i was referring to torque, not horsepower.
and tom, i have seen your replies to my other posts and i will repeat my original statement: i dont believe the numbers that people are claiming to see from stock SS's and them being greater than those stated by GM, nor will i believe it until i actually see it on a dyno myself.

now i typed in "chevy cobalt dyno" into my search engine and clicked on the first link with someone who has only put on an intake, he got 187hp and 172 lb-ft of torque at the wheels. i have also seen ppl posting numbers much higher in the past as well, who to believe?

Here are some dyno graphs i pinched from redlineforums.com

<one >

< two >

< three >

"The first "measured" run was in 3rd gear, second run in 4th gear, and third run in 3rd gear."

Ta, Paul.

mathmatical proof. lol
Yeah One Headers (lol) + another mod= 185 ft lbs of torque = cobalt ss killa.
Textbook physics.

Like I said, with bolt ons you will probably see 150 hp at most.

well if you look at those links that vxer provided, the cobalt SS is 182.75 ft lbs and if you look at that stuff you mock above, you would see that i would need 172 lb ft of torque at the wheels.
now in another post, i saw a dyno for the stock eco (possiby with an intake) with 135 lb ft of torque. thats 37 lb ft to gain. and if you had actually learned to read, a little higher i have a list i had made, consisting of MORE than bolt ons that you made your original coment on.

maybe you should consider posting an apology and actually offer something constructive to one of your posts instead of looking for places to call people out.

CK wrote: Now, lets clarify, to beat an SS, i am not going to need to modify my top speed, i am going to need to increase my acceleration.

lets compare the stock 2005 SS with my stock 2005 LS.
Cobalt LS -145hp, 155lb-ft, 15 inch wheels (overall dia - approx 24 ")
Cobalt SS - 205hp, 200lb-ft, 18 inch wheels (overall dia - approx 25.5")

25.5/24 *100% = 106.25%
which means that the SS has 6.25% and needs 6.25 % more torque to accelerate at the same rate as the LS.
so the torque needed to match the SS with 15 inch tires would be:
200lb-ft/1.0625 = 188 lb-ft of torque

So, correct me if i am wrong but i have heard that the weapon R intake gives 7hp and 17lb-ft of torque...this will probably be my first modification.
155lb-ft +17lb-ft = 172lb-ft

that means that i have 16 lb-ft that needs to be gained by adding bolt ons:
-header
-cat back exhaust
-fuel system upgrade

I doesn't work like that.
You won't gain 17 ft lbs of torque from a header.
I dyno'ed my stock 05 sunfire 5spd: 121 hp and 127 ft lbs.
With a kand n filter power rose to 125 hp and 134 ft lbs.
While the 04' is sitting right now at 141 hp and 140 ft lbs.

Now the 04' is capable of mid 15's to low 15's.
SS Cobalts stock run mid 14's.
A stock cobalt 5spd is slower than a J-body ecotec.
Torque doesn't determine everything.
Horsepower has a LOT to do with speed.



I will eventually go the forced induction route, but for now i am interested in all parts that are available/will work on the car keeping forced induction in mind.

These include (some of which i have already found but wouldnt mind hearing a review):
-pistons- If you go high compression for more power, they won't be good for boost
-rods-Good mod
-crankshaft- Needed for engines over 550-600 hp
-intake manifold and air filter- What's wrong with the stock IM, Air filter included with intake
-camshafts- you need cams for boost, not as good for n/a power. Will probably loose n/a power is boost cams are used
-cam gears
-valve springs- always good
-racing block- ?, stock block is fine. New sleeves needed at higher horsepower
-ignition
-fuel system- n/a you won't need, but for boost you will need bigger injectors
-onboard computer (maybe custom)
-clutch upgrade- good
-cooling system- ?
-differential- lsd def good
-modification for AWD/RWD- lol

ok those were numbers that Weapon R has claimed to gain at the wheels, and also, this is an intake, the header is for exhaust.....sounds like you have the two confused.
Whether the gains posted are true or not, it was JUST A NUMBER to throw in.

Quote:

Torque doesn't determine everything.
Horsepower has a LOT to do with speed.

Actually as i stated in a previous post, horsepower is a result of rotational speed and torque. it goes back to that physics that you dont seem like. Also as i stated, torque will be the issue as it determines acceleration, the track just isnt long enough for top speed to be an issue.


I will eventually go the forced induction route, but for now i am interested in all parts that are available/will work on the car keeping forced induction in mind.

These include (some of which i have already found but wouldnt mind hearing a review):
-pistons- If you go high compression for more power, they won't be good for boost
-the eventual goal is forced induction so lower compression, GM or is there better available?

-rods - Good mod
- thanks, best to stick with GM?

-crankshaft- Needed for engines over 550-600 hp
- do you know of one thats available other than the GM one.

-intake manifold and air filter- What's wrong with the stock IM, Air filter included with intake
-Problem is "laminar flow," .....another term....might consider port matching stock. Intake will be weapon r, prob first mod....will post dyno of before and after to see what kind of numbers we get.

-camshafts- you need cams for boost, not as good for n/a power. Will probably loose n/a power is boost cams are used
- great, do you know of any or would i be better off getting some machined myself

-cam gears
-Did you miss this one? i thought there was lots available

-valve springs- always good
- great, do you know of any? cause i can take one to the local technical institution and get some metalurgy students to make me something too

-racing block- ?, stock block is fine. New sleeves needed at higher horsepower
- high budget, this would be easier for me, plus define 'higher' horsepower

-ignition
- Did you miss this one? MSD?

-fuel system- n/a you won't need, but for boost you will need bigger injectors
- new pump, better lines, better injectors, can you suggest something. venom?

-onboard computer (maybe custom)

-clutch upgrade - good
- thanks, so whats available and what have you heard

-cooling system- ?
- yep thats right cooling system, with the aim at a set ambient temperature in the engine bay, know where i can get some aftermarket parts? i have already found lots, not a big deal.

-differential- lsd def good
- great, recommendations?

-modification for AWD/RWD- lol
- ??isnt it funny that when it doesnt come in a nice easy bolt on kit, that people try to mock you.....was going to take parts from a wrecked lancer, but i have something else that i tried before.

CK wrote: this is an intake, the header is for exhaust.....sounds like you have the two confused.

lol

I will eventually go the forced induction route, but for now i am interested in all parts that are available/will work on the car keeping forced induction in mind.

These include (some of which i have already found but wouldnt mind hearing a review):
-pistons- If you go high compression for more power, they won't be good for boost
-the eventual goal is forced induction so lower compression, GM or is there better available?
Any piston manufacturor. JE, Ross, ect.

-rods - Good mod
- thanks, best to stick with GM?
eagle rods
-crankshaft- Needed for engines over 550-600 hp
- do you know of one thats available other than the GM one.
eagle, the gm one is $3K
-intake manifold and air filter- What's wrong with the stock IM, Air filter included with intake
-Problem is "laminar flow," .....another term....might consider port matching stock. Intake will be weapon r, prob first mod....will post dyno of before and after to see what kind of numbers we get.

-camshafts- you need cams for boost, not as good for n/a power. Will probably loose n/a power is boost cams are used
- great, do you know of any or would i be better off getting some machined myself
Crane and comp cams. Just call them up and tell them what you want.
-cam gears
-Did you miss this one? i thought there was lots available
Tried on a couple n/a engines with no gain. Might help with the adjustability.
-valve springs- always good
- great, do you know of any? cause i can take one to the local technical institution and get some metalurgy students to make me something too
Crane and Comp cams.
-racing block- ?, stock block is fine. New sleeves needed at higher horsepower
- high budget, this would be easier for me, plus define 'higher' horsepower
I think it was like 600 hp.
-ignition
- Did you miss this one? MSD?
Well, you got msd's distributor, or just the dis II. If you're going all out, the distributor is the way to go.

-fuel system- n/a you won't need, but for boost you will need bigger injectors
- new pump, better lines, better injectors, can you suggest something. venom?

-onboard computer (maybe custom)
TEC, ect.

-clutch upgrade - good
- thanks, so whats available and what have you heard
spec
-cooling system- ?
- yep thats right cooling system, with the aim at a set ambient temperature in the engine bay, know where i can get some aftermarket parts? i have already found lots, not a big deal.
Aluminum radiator.

-differential- lsd def good
- great, recommendations?
Quiffe, or phantom grip
-modification for AWD/RWD- lol
- ??isnt it funny that when it doesnt come in a nice easy bolt on kit, that people try to mock you.....was going to take parts from a wrecked lancer, but i have something else that i tried before. lol, If you can get the trans, diff, and axles to work. More power to ya. And you would be the first in a street car. Because for the driveshaft, you have to make a driveshaft tunnel and then you have to mount the rear diffy. Then you need a suspension setup the will allow you to use the rear differential.

Wow you guys fight a lot.....I have an automatic, and on an 1/8 mile track I beat my friends stock ss usually 9.763 to 10.037, or in the vecinity of those times. That's before my zex kit. I don't have a manual, but I've heard that if I had a manual I could decrease my time by about .7 seconds. If that is true, then I would beat them by almost a full second. The chevy dealers in town had the ss crank power at 205. Not sure what that would be at the wheels.