will the roots type blower available for the 04 cavalier work on a 2.2 grand am? I just want to hear from people who have done it?

Don't know anyone who has done it but it will physically fit, yes.


www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837

hey NJHK thanx for your help. Im trying to get into the ecotec scene and im narrowing my choice down to a cavalier or a grand am. it seems like a supercharger can get me good performance. The supercharger fits, then, but would you recommend it? What other mods would be involved?

Will Madisen wrote:hey NJHK thanx for your help. Im trying to get into the ecotec scene and im narrowing my choice down to a cavalier or a grand am. it seems like a supercharger can get me good performance. The supercharger fits, then, but would you recommend it? What other mods would be involved?

Get a Cavalier and Buy the GM Supercharger Kit.

The ECOTEC Cavaliers are:

2002 Cavalier LS Sports & 2003-2005 Cavaliers All Models


www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837

and you're welcome


www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837

Whats wrong with the grand am? becuz it weighs 3066 lbs. or becuz it has independent rear suspension?

Josh Long wrote:Whats wrong with the grand am? becuz it weighs 3066 lbs. or becuz it has independent rear suspension?

Neither.

If he has a Cavalier, he go straight to the dealership and buy that kit and not have to touch his car and he'll have a 13 second cavalier.


www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837

1 who likes dealerships?
2 who likes kits?
Not I said the kid with the 5 speed Grand Am.

Josh Long wrote:1 who likes dealerships?
2 who likes kits?
Not I said the kid with the 5 speed Grand Am.

Ok...and thats you.

Your dislike for dealerships in general is kind of flawed. There are plenty of good dealerships out there, everyone is different because they are independent in how they are operated or how well they operate.

It just depends on the person.

But no offense, you said it yourself, "kid". Some people just want something that is a good deal and less headache so they can go about their life without worrying about if something is going to happen every week.


www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837

how do you know why i dislike dealerships dont tell me its flawed when you dont even know why i dont like them becuz if you thinks im like every other dealership disliker out there you are sadly mistaken..

KaKe$23 wrote:how do you know why i dislike dealerships dont tell me its flawed when you dont even know why i dont like them becuz if you thinks im like every other dealership disliker out there you are sadly mistaken..

I can understand if you don't like a certain dealership but to say you hate EVERY dealership IS flawed because you evidently haven't dealt with every dealership. There are plenty out there that operate perfect fine and please the customer just fine.

Dealerships are independent so of course they are all going to be different.



www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837

NJHK wrote:

KaKe$23 wrote:how do you know why i dislike dealerships dont tell me its flawed when you dont even know why i dont like them becuz if you thinks im like every other dealership disliker out there you are sadly mistaken..

I can understand if you don't like a certain dealership but to say you hate EVERY dealership IS flawed because you evidently haven't dealt with every dealership. There are plenty out there that operate perfect fine and please the customer just fine.

Dealerships are independent so of course they are all going to be different.

Let me just say this kid...cause i think you missed the point...i believe what kake$ was saying that people like money and people like a good product...what a dealership offers is a medioker product at a very high price...so if you do not like good quality prices and products..then you will deff like a dealer...when someone would make a statement like kake$ has....i would see no flaws...because when you examine a category such as Dealerships....you must look at the pros and cons of a dealer...now when you say "Dealer" i would assume you mean a business that Deals GM Vehicles....there for the dealers would have a certain price guideline that GM has gave them....in order to make money in a business you would have to make your parts more expensive then it would be if you bought the whole motor...thus making the part that all ready broke more expensive then what you would get if you bought it somewhere else...or made it your self....so with that in mind...i would say that EVERY dealership is in fact flawed because of the guidelines they would have to follow set in by GM....you may find allot of help there about your car...but with the same amount of time...less money you can have the same knowledge by looking it up...not only do you know more about what your talking about but your not spending your time and money on something that is going to give you a headache even more...and no you wont be in the 13's w/ a torsion and a supercharger...i would love to see one of them..ima say you will run the same as you would if you went independent suspension and dropped in some polly mounts intake and exhaust...about $400 so don't blow 3g's on something that isn't good....and the reason i can say this with confidence is.....well because me and kakes both have independent Ecotec's and we have been spankin kids in cavi's just like yours since 02.....furthermore i would like to point out that a cobalt ss is a supercharged cavi...and they DO NOT run 13's you will be lucky if you get that torsion in 14's...once again i know this because have seen them....and have drove them...and raced them in the 1/4 A lot...

Also i would like to add....that a person or a small business would have a better product because of the quality a craftsman gives...dealership items are not crafted by quality they are crafted by quantity..that alone should prove mine and kake$ theory correct...and of coarse if you need more in depth schooling in understanding the laws of physics i will gladly explain it to you....im not understanding why you would think a torsion bar I4 fwd sporting a supercharger would make any thing but some smoke and an angry person that thinks there gonna go 13's in a torsion by adding a supercharger....that is no diff then what a cobalt has all ready and they dint even touch 13's esp when your trying to shift and all you hear is slam slam slam from your springs and shocks slamming against the torsion....oh and you can spend about the same price and get a turbo and run 13's....

so please....don't go tell some one to buy a torsion and then put a supercharger on it....its like asking a midget if you can put them on a leash...you just dint do it....you sit there quietly cause you really dint know what your talking about...and stop miss leading people thinking that torsions and superchargers mix like blue berries and yogurt....and please don't hate on the GA cause its got a better interior...girls like it more then the cavi...its got independent suspension...and it is about 200lbs heaver...think about it...how do you go from 0 to anywhere if your back end has to drop against the torsion bar 1st......don't step up unless you can put it down....

and if you still don't believe me....
you can go to any tuning shop and spend just as much money...maybe even less money and come out with a car that is about 100x better and faster then a dealership item....so if you don't feel like doing the work....give the business to the better quality and priced small business...remember a big name had to worry about quantity...they sacrifice quality for quantity....

Also as a side note just in case.....
a 4cyl has only 4 cyl's to spin up the supercharger......there is only so fast you can spin something on a belt....and it takes allot to make PSI....so you want to add a supercharger for about 8 psi...you will loose about 45% of what you gain...and now the motor takes 2x as long to make rpm's....for a messily 40hp that your going to loose by the tires spinning....so now not only do you have to make your suspension good but your not going to make more then 8psi with out allot of money and work....so when you get your supercharger and you put it on...you just learned allot about your car...now you think ok...i want to do more...maybe this time i can do it my self...nope...gotta pretty much replace the whole thing for more gains...so its like spending 6g's on something your going to use for about a year....some one else may think its smart...but i sure as hell don't....


167,000 on an Ecotec since 02

Prophit wrote:

NJHK wrote:

KaKe$23 wrote:how do you know why i dislike dealerships dont tell me its flawed when you dont even know why i dont like them becuz if you thinks im like every other dealership disliker out there you are sadly mistaken..

I can understand if you don't like a certain dealership but to say you hate EVERY dealership IS flawed because you evidently haven't dealt with every dealership. There are plenty out there that operate perfect fine and please the customer just fine.

Dealerships are independent so of course they are all going to be different.

Let me just say this kid...cause i think you missed the point...i believe what kake$ was saying that people like money and people like a good product...what a dealership offers is a medioker product at a very high price...so if you do not like good quality prices and products..then you will deff like a dealer...when someone would make a statement like kake$ has....i would see no flaws...because when you examine a category such as Dealerships....you must look at the pros and cons of a dealer...now when you say "Dealer" i would assume you mean a business that Deals GM Vehicles....there for the dealers would have a certain price guideline that GM has gave them....in order to make money in a business you would have to make your parts more expensive then it would be if you bought the whole motor...thus making the part that all ready broke more expensive then what you would get if you bought it somewhere else...or made it your self....so with that in mind...i would say that EVERY dealership is in fact flawed because of the guidelines they would have to follow set in by GM....you may find allot of help there about your car...but with the same amount of time...less money you can have the same knowledge by looking it up...not only do you know more about what your talking about but your not spending your time and money on something that is going to give you a headache even more...and no you wont be in the 13's w/ a torsion and a supercharger...i would love to see one of them..ima say you will run the same as you would if you went independent suspension and dropped in some polly mounts intake and exhaust...about $400 so don't blow 3g's on something that isn't good....and the reason i can say this with confidence is.....well because me and kakes both have independent Ecotec's and we have been spankin kids in cavi's just like yours since 02.....furthermore i would like to point out that a cobalt ss is a supercharged cavi...and they DO NOT run 13's you will be lucky if you get that torsion in 14's...once again i know this because have seen them....and have drove them...and raced them in the 1/4 A lot...

Also i would like to add....that a person or a small business would have a better product because of the quality a craftsman gives...dealership items are not crafted by quality they are crafted by quantity..that alone should prove mine and kake$ theory correct...and of coarse if you need more in depth schooling in understanding the laws of physics i will gladly explain it to you....im not understanding why you would think a torsion bar I4 fwd sporting a supercharger would make any thing but some smoke and an angry person that thinks there gonna go 13's in a torsion by adding a supercharger....that is no diff then what a cobalt has all ready and they dint even touch 13's esp when your trying to shift and all you hear is slam slam slam from your springs and shocks slamming against the torsion....oh and you can spend about the same price and get a turbo and run 13's....

so please....don't go tell some one to buy a torsion and then put a supercharger on it....its like asking a midget if you can put them on a leash...you just dint do it....you sit there quietly cause you really dint know what your talking about...and stop miss leading people thinking that torsions and superchargers mix like blue berries and yogurt....and please don't hate on the GA cause its got a better interior...girls like it more then the cavi...its got independent suspension...and it is about 200lbs heaver...think about it...how do you go from 0 to anywhere if your back end has to drop against the torsion bar 1st......don't step up unless you can put it down....

and if you still don't believe me....
you can go to any tuning shop and spend just as much money...maybe even less money and come out with a car that is about 100x better and faster then a dealership item....so if you don't feel like doing the work....give the business to the better quality and priced small business...remember a big name had to worry about quantity...they sacrifice quality for quantity....

Also as a side note just in case.....
a 4cyl has only 4 cyl's to spin up the supercharger......there is only so fast you can spin something on a belt....and it takes allot to make PSI....so you want to add a supercharger for about 8 psi...you will loose about 45% of what you gain...and now the motor takes 2x as long to make rpm's....for a messily 40hp that your going to loose by the tires spinning....so now not only do you have to make your suspension good but your not going to make more then 8psi with out allot of money and work....so when you get your supercharger and you put it on...you just learned allot about your car...now you think ok...i want to do more...maybe this time i can do it my self...nope...gotta pretty much replace the whole thing for more gains...so its like spending 6g's on something your going to use for about a year....some one else may think its smart...but i sure as hell don't....

First of all, don't call me a kid. I'm a grown ass man and a father at that (23 years old).

Second, do your research before you make statements stating they can't run 13s. My best friend was bone stock, added the supercharger and with improvement eventually ran 13.5 in the 1/4 mile at Englishtown (Raceway Park) in New Jersey. He was peaking 9 PSI and this was a L61 Cavalier.

Had his car for over a year supercharged and traded it in for a Solstice GXP.

The dealership comment was surrounding service. They offer one supercharger package that is from GM themselves, NOT the dealership. The dealership doesn't make up kits. It's a GMPP item.



www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837

well let me just say a few more things...sounds like you are telling me things in a frantic panic to win the argument....I will start out by explaining to you why indeed you are a kid despite your child at home and your age of 23...I my self am 24 and have been with my girl for 7 years...I only say that to you because you seem to think that you having a child would make you responsible...and if that is not the case you would feel like an adult because of the fact that you have been in a relationship long enough to constitute a kid...there for my mentioning of being 24 and with my girl for 7 years would be about the same in your situation....obviously im not saying I have a kid....I am merely stating that you have no more then I do...and yet you precede to be a kid....now I guess the next question you would have is...how am I still a kid?....well let me tell you...what a kid normally would do is throw out some random fact...in witch they did not review...or did not seem to even think about what was said or what to say.....and you did that by 1st saying "Get a Cavalier and Buy the GM Supercharger Kit" in the posts above....then the next line you made is..."If he has a Cavalier, he could go straight to the dealership and buy that kit and not have to touch his car and he'll have a 13 second cavalier."...then after the statement you made there...I will point out the part of witch is wrong...or flawed as you like to say...look very closely at your statement...."he will not have to touch his car and run 13's"....but it seems in this next statement that is not the case..."Second, do your research before you make statements stating they can't run 13s. My best friend was bone stock, added the supercharger and with improvement eventually ran 13.5 in the 1/4 mile at Englishtown (Raceway Park) in New Jersey. He was peaking 9 PSI and this was a L61 Cavalier."...see you said b-4 he could run 13's with a S/C and not have to touch his car...then you proceed to tell me that I am wrong in my statement...when I merle pointed out that you can not run 13's by simply taking your car to a dealer and have a s/c put on...and you have backed my statement up by saying "My best friend was bone stock, added the supercharger and with improvement eventually ran 13.5 in the 1/4 mile"....ya like I said...you cant do it if you just get bolt on s/c...however you CAN run 13's on a bone stock motor with nothing more then a turbo kit....and NO IMPROVEMENT....just the bolt on and a torsion...there was no research to do...I am not the one making the statements then frantically trying to change what I have said..In hopes that you would not catch it and make me look more like an ars....

And what about the dealership...well like I said...GM gives the dealer the price guideline...and the quality of the product.....a dealer has no control over quality and prices....don't know what you mean...sounds like you just emphasized what I have said...please don't come at me like you know...then drop out some lines....and still think your right....I am only giving the advice that it is not in your best interest to supercharge a 4 cyl...esp w/ a torsion...if you were looking for an easier...less time consuming...and cheaper way to do something get independent and drop a turbo on it....if a supercharger and a torsion is such a good idea why did he sell his car for independent?

also I think I have seen that car....didn't he have a suspension...and slicks....I would think if you change one thing on the car it turns it from stock to modified....anything that isn't factory is well modded....except in this case where we are talking about a stock car with a s/c not a stock motor....cause its an ecotec and that is an obvious statement of course the ecotec can handle it.....I think that’s why I was talking about the torsion bar and independent suspension.....and if you are one of those ppl that think "why did GM supercharge there Torsion SS if its so bad" well GM is trying to keep it American muscle....and that would be a s/c route because once again in the business market you have to appeal to your customers....obviously since GM is American they would want to stick with domestic products...and since America is made up of mostly muscle car fans...who wouldn't put a s/c on there torsion to sell it to the American crowd....so please post up another comment and I shall proceed to explain to you supercharger, turbocharger, and suspensions schematics..and the pro's and con's of each...to further your knowledge and understanding the laws of physics...and how its so important to reduce inertia...and to have a more efficient motor...if we are to looking at witch one is better...these are the things to look at...not how fast a s/c one goes already..because that does not make some thing better....if you want to look at the details of a motor setup and why one is better then the other then we look at what one offers compared to the other....and my friend...a s/c doesn't offer anything....unless you want to enter a burnout competition....a turbo offers basically free hp...you say to me...well how my prophit...how does the turbo make free power....well lets see...you have what is called "hot expanding gasses" that is what powers the turbo....the hotter you get your gasses the faster the exhaust goes....now when you put a turbo in between exhaust gasses and the exit of the pipe....you now get all that energy that was being wasted by not doing anything but exitig the exhaust….it now powers your turbine....now you say...well if you put something in between expanding gasses...and the exit...you get what is called back pressure...witch in turn makes you loose power...well your right...it does cost power...so now you say..well then im right a s/c and a turbo do the same thing....take power to give power....no your just dumb and have not researched the subject properly....when you have your gasses that was previously not doing anything but going into the atmosphere a proper turbo setup you start to make boost...now with a properly tuned vehicle...on the intake side you have that boost that is going into your piston...each piston gets its fill at a diff time...so that would mean when 1 piston is on the exhaust stroke another is on the intake stoke.....and I believe they are connected by a common shaft called a "crank" so that would mean when one piston is intake stoke is making more pressure then the other piston is on its exhaust stroke it can now push the exhaust out hotter and faster....thus spinning the turbine faster to make up for the losses you would have by putting a restriction in your exhaust..Thus a turbo makes what would be known as "free power" a S/C does the same thing except there is no restriction in the exhaust...witch has energy being wasted....instead w/ a supercharger you have to use the inertia the motor to power the supercharger...to make small gains such as 9psi....and if you would like to go over that # it involves getting allot more then what a turbo would need.....just some pipes and an inter-cooler…..because of the thing called "pressure drop" in between the turbo/S/C and the Combustion chamber.....for a supercharger because of the fact that you rely on the motor to make power 1st b-4 you can see gains off the supercharger....and the gains are so small because in order to make PSI you need to spin the pulley turbine upwards of over 25,000 rpm and that’s the lowest # that’s even feasible make 1psi...and since the motor only spins at a max of 6500 rpm it would seem imposable….of course you spend allot of money swapping out pulleys and...fixing broken belts...and when you spin the supercharger to its max...well guess what you cant just swap out a supercharger its self...nope most of em you have to buy a whole new setup....as to where a turbo...if you need more...just buy a bigger turbo keep the setup you have...change some a/f ratios...about 1 hr to change your cam timing to the right setting..and your off with more power...for under $1000....and if your worried about how fast a turbo can spool well you can make full boost with a proper turbo setup at 2k ...witch I believe is about where you start making boost on a s/c...so you tell me...why again is the supercharger better cause a dealer has one...because I know about 12 tuning shops that will do the work for you...better then a dealer...and cheaper then one....because a tuning shop offers knowledge about performance..As to where a dealer offers knowledge about GM vehicles...so I encourage you to post up some more un factual statements so I can further expand your knowledge…and understanding of cars…and if you have time to read…maybe the world…



167,000 on an Ecotec since 02

Prophit wrote:well let me just say a few more things...sounds like you are telling me things in a frantic panic to win the argument....I will start out by explaining to you why indeed you are a kid despite your child at home and your age of 23...I my self am 24 and have been with my girl for 7 years...I only say that to you because you seem to think that you having a child would make you responsible...and if that is not the case you would feel like an adult because of the fact that you have been in a relationship long enough to constitute a kid...there for my mentioning of being 24 and with my girl for 7 years would be about the same in your situation....obviously im not saying I have a kid....I am merely stating that you have no more then I do...and yet you precede to be a kid....now I guess the next question you would have is...how am I still a kid?....well let me tell you...what a kid normally would do is throw out some random fact...in witch they did not review...or did not seem to even think about what was said or what to say.....and you did that by 1st saying "Get a Cavalier and Buy the GM Supercharger Kit" in the posts above....then the next line you made is..."If he has a Cavalier, he could go straight to the dealership and buy that kit and not have to touch his car and he'll have a 13 second cavalier."...then after the statement you made there...I will point out the part of witch is wrong...or flawed as you like to say...look very closely at your statement...."he will not have to touch his car and run 13's"....but it seems in this next statement that is not the case..."Second, do your research before you make statements stating they can't run 13s. My best friend was bone stock, added the supercharger and with improvement eventually ran 13.5 in the 1/4 mile at Englishtown (Raceway Park) in New Jersey. He was peaking 9 PSI and this was a L61 Cavalier."...see you said b-4 he could run 13's with a S/C and not have to touch his car...then you proceed to tell me that I am wrong in my statement...when I merle pointed out that you can not run 13's by simply taking your car to a dealer and have a s/c put on...and you have backed my statement up by saying "My best friend was bone stock, added the supercharger and with improvement eventually ran 13.5 in the 1/4 mile"....ya like I said...you cant do it if you just get bolt on s/c...however you CAN run 13's on a bone stock motor with nothing more then a turbo kit....and NO IMPROVEMENT....just the bolt on and a torsion...there was no research to do...I am not the one making the statements then frantically trying to change what I have said..In hopes that you would not catch it and make me look more like an ars....

And what about the dealership...well like I said...GM gives the dealer the price guideline...and the quality of the product.....a dealer has no control over quality and prices....don't know what you mean...sounds like you just emphasized what I have said...please don't come at me like you know...then drop out some lines....and still think your right....I am only giving the advice that it is not in your best interest to supercharge a 4 cyl...esp w/ a torsion...if you were looking for an easier...less time consuming...and cheaper way to do something get independent and drop a turbo on it....if a supercharger and a torsion is such a good idea why did he sell his car for independent?

also I think I have seen that car....didn't he have a suspension...and slicks....I would think if you change one thing on the car it turns it from stock to modified....anything that isn't factory is well modded....except in this case where we are talking about a stock car with a s/c not a stock motor....cause its an ecotec and that is an obvious statement of course the ecotec can handle it.....I think that’s why I was talking about the torsion bar and independent suspension.....and if you are one of those ppl that think "why did GM supercharge there Torsion SS if its so bad" well GM is trying to keep it American muscle....and that would be a s/c route because once again in the business market you have to appeal to your customers....obviously since GM is American they would want to stick with domestic products...and since America is made up of mostly muscle car fans...who wouldn't put a s/c on there torsion to sell it to the American crowd....so please post up another comment and I shall proceed to explain to you supercharger, turbocharger, and suspensions schematics..and the pro's and con's of each...to further your knowledge and understanding the laws of physics...and how its so important to reduce inertia...and to have a more efficient motor...if we are to looking at witch one is better...these are the things to look at...not how fast a s/c one goes already..because that does not make some thing better....if you want to look at the details of a motor setup and why one is better then the other then we look at what one offers compared to the other....and my friend...a s/c doesn't offer anything....unless you want to enter a burnout competition....a turbo offers basically free hp...you say to me...well how my prophit...how does the turbo make free power....well lets see...you have what is called "hot expanding gasses" that is what powers the turbo....the hotter you get your gasses the faster the exhaust goes....now when you put a turbo in between exhaust gasses and the exit of the pipe....you now get all that energy that was being wasted by not doing anything but exitig the exhaust….it now powers your turbine....now you say...well if you put something in between expanding gasses...and the exit...you get what is called back pressure...witch in turn makes you loose power...well your right...it does cost power...so now you say..well then im right a s/c and a turbo do the same thing....take power to give power....no your just dumb and have not researched the subject properly....when you have your gasses that was previously not doing anything but going into the atmosphere a proper turbo setup you start to make boost...now with a properly tuned vehicle...on the intake side you have that boost that is going into your piston...each piston gets its fill at a diff time...so that would mean when 1 piston is on the exhaust stroke another is on the intake stoke.....and I believe they are connected by a common shaft called a "crank" so that would mean when one piston is intake stoke is making more pressure then the other piston is on its exhaust stroke it can now push the exhaust out hotter and faster....thus spinning the turbine faster to make up for the losses you would have by putting a restriction in your exhaust..Thus a turbo makes what would be known as "free power" a S/C does the same thing except there is no restriction in the exhaust...witch has energy being wasted....instead w/ a supercharger you have to use the inertia the motor to power the supercharger...to make small gains such as 9psi....and if you would like to go over that # it involves getting allot more then what a turbo would need.....just some pipes and an inter-cooler…..because of the thing called "pressure drop" in between the turbo/S/C and the Combustion chamber.....for a supercharger because of the fact that you rely on the motor to make power 1st b-4 you can see gains off the supercharger....and the gains are so small because in order to make PSI you need to spin the pulley turbine upwards of over 25,000 rpm and that’s the lowest # that’s even feasible make 1psi...and since the motor only spins at a max of 6500 rpm it would seem imposable….of course you spend allot of money swapping out pulleys and...fixing broken belts...and when you spin the supercharger to its max...well guess what you cant just swap out a supercharger its self...nope most of em you have to buy a whole new setup....as to where a turbo...if you need more...just buy a bigger turbo keep the setup you have...change some a/f ratios...about 1 hr to change your cam timing to the right setting..and your off with more power...for under $1000....and if your worried about how fast a turbo can spool well you can make full boost with a proper turbo setup at 2k ...witch I believe is about where you start making boost on a s/c...so you tell me...why again is the supercharger better cause a dealer has one...because I know about 12 tuning shops that will do the work for you...better then a dealer...and cheaper then one....because a tuning shop offers knowledge about performance..As to where a dealer offers knowledge about GM vehicles...so I encourage you to post up some more un factual statements so I can further expand your knowledge…and understanding of cars…and if you have time to read…maybe the world…

WOW!


We designed to dominate thats mans natural instinct,
And put it on the line like reputations and pink slips.
-MADROX

Quote:

well let me just say a few more things...sounds like you are telling me things in a frantic panic to win the argument....

It's called not caring enough to reply with 8 pages of typing...

Quote:

I will start out by explaining to you why indeed you are a kid despite your child at home and your age of 23...

Honestly, you seriously don't know anything about me to even try to attempt to pin point why you think I'm a child.
No one called you a kid, you called me one. I said kid to the other person because he called himself a kid.

You are diagnosing something that doesn't need diagnosing and you're on the edge of being out of line so watch your conduct on this forum.

Quote:

what a kid normally would do is throw out some random fact...in witch they did not review...or did not seem to even think about what was said or what to say.....and you did that by 1st saying "Get a Cavalier and Buy the GM Supercharger Kit" in the posts above....then the next line you made is..."If he has a Cavalier, he could go straight to the dealership and buy that kit and not have to touch his car and he'll have a 13 second cavalier."...then after the statement you made there...I will point out the part of witch is wrong...or flawed as you like to say...look very closely at your statement...."he will not have to touch his car and run 13's"....but it seems in this next statement that is not the case..."Second, do your research before you make statements stating they can't run 13s. My best friend was bone stock, added the supercharger and with improvement eventually ran 13.5 in the 1/4 mile at Englishtown (Raceway Park) in New Jersey. He was peaking 9 PSI and this was a L61 Cavalier."...see you said b-4 he could run 13's with a S/C and not have to touch his car...

It's called learning how to drive better with a FWD vehicle with lots of torque. In the beginning everytime he launched in 1st gear he was pulling towards the wall and then he started launching in 2nd gear and still pulled off 14.0-14.1 constantly. He started to re-attempt to launch better in 1st and eventually finished with a 13.5

Quote:

I am not the one making the statements then frantically trying to change what I have said..

Never changed my statement and everything I said was realistic. How many people do you know with the supercharger kits and show results?

Quote:

if a supercharger and a torsion is such a good idea why did he sell his car for independent?

He wanted a status car...he would have gotten a BMW but was out of his range. This isn't a 16 year old kid either, he's 28 y/o. He enjoyed his vehicle very much.

Quote:

also I think I have seen that car....didn't he have a suspension...and slicks....I would think if you change one thing on the car it turns it from stock to modified....anything that isn't factory is well modded....

Key word is "Think". Wrong person...

Street tires (not even radials), Stock Suspension, Stock Exhaust System...

Quote:

so please post up another comment and I shall proceed to explain to you supercharger, turbocharger, and suspensions schematics..and the pro's and con's of each...to further your knowledge and understanding the laws of physics...and how its so important to reduce inertia...and to have a more efficient motor...if we are to looking at witch one is better...these are the things to look at...not how fast a s/c one goes already..because that does not make some thing better....

Please...please...stop trying to belittle me because you evidently once again don't know anything about me. I for one am not the biggest supercharger fan...I'm a true turbo fanboi, ask anyone. I know about inertia, I know about efficiency and I could keep on. I would link you to all my write ups where I try to help others understand but then you would probably (not saying you would) try to downplay what I already know.

Quote:

if you want to look at the details of a motor setup and why one is better then the other then we look at what one offers compared to the other....and my friend...a s/c doesn't offer anything....unless you want to enter a burnout competition....a turbo offers basically free hp...you say to me...well how my prophit...how does the turbo make free power....well lets see...you have what is called "hot expanding gasses" that is what powers the turbo....the hotter you get your gasses the faster the exhaust goes....now when you put a turbo in between exhaust gasses and the exit of the pipe....you now get all that energy that was being wasted by not doing anything but exitig the exhaust….it now powers your turbine....now you say...well if you put something in between expanding gasses...and the exit...you get what is called back pressure...witch in turn makes you loose power...well your right...it does cost power...so now you say..well then im right a s/c and a turbo do the same thing....take power to give power....no your just dumb and have not researched the subject properly....when you have your gasses that was previously not doing anything but going into the atmosphere a proper turbo setup you start to make boost...now with a properly tuned vehicle...on the intake side you have that boost that is going into your piston...each piston gets its fill at a diff time...so that would mean when 1 piston is on the exhaust stroke another is on the intake stoke.....and I believe they are connected by a common shaft called a "crank" so that would mean when one piston is intake stoke is making more pressure then the other piston is on its exhaust stroke it can now push the exhaust out hotter and faster....thus spinning the turbine faster to make up for the losses you would have by putting a restriction in your exhaust..Thus a turbo makes what would be known as "free power" a S/C does the same thing except there is no restriction in the exhaust...witch has energy being wasted....instead w/ a supercharger you have to use the inertia the motor to power the supercharger...to make small gains such as 9psi....and if you would like to go over that # it involves getting allot more then what a turbo would need.....just some pipes and an inter-cooler…..because of the thing called "pressure drop" in between the turbo/S/C and the Combustion chamber.....for a supercharger because of the fact that you rely on the motor to make power 1st b-4 you can see gains off the supercharger....and the gains are so small because in order to make PSI you need to spin the pulley turbine upwards of over 25,000 rpm and that’s the lowest # that’s even feasible make 1psi...and since the motor only spins at a max of 6500 rpm it would seem imposable….of course you spend allot of money swapping out pulleys and...fixing broken belts...and when you spin the supercharger to its max...well guess what you cant just swap out a supercharger its self...nope most of em you have to buy a whole new setup....as to where a turbo...if you need more...just buy a bigger turbo keep the setup you have...change some a/f ratios...about 1 hr to change your cam timing to the right setting..and your off with more power...for under $1000....and if your worried about how fast a turbo can spool well you can make full boost with a proper turbo setup at 2k ...witch I believe is about where you start making boost on a s/c...so you tell me...

I love how you talk to yourself...lol

Quote:

why again is the supercharger better cause a dealer has one...

I never said it's better than turbocharging and you'll never hear that out of my mouth BUT some people like comfort in just buying a kit, taking it to the dealer to install it, reflashing their PCMs and calling it a day with a warranty. That's them, not me.

Quote:

so I encourage you to post up some more un factual statements so I can further expand your knowledge…and understanding of cars…and if you have time to read…maybe the world…

Wow...

Seriously, if you want to stay on this forum, watch yourself in how you talk to people here, including myself, moderator or not. Like I said, I can show you my write ups if you want so you can see what I do know but honestly I shouldn't have prove myself to you or anyone else.

You're arguing a topic is rediculous to argue about and shouldn't even be argued. I gave my opinion and you can give yours but you're going about it in the wrong way. I told YOU to do some research, not about cars and how they work but talking about people and their performance numbers with the GM supercharger kit.

If you can't continue to discuss this without trying to insult or belittle, then I'll just lock the thread and apologize to the original poster for his thread being ruined.


www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837

I don’t think you under stand kid...I do not like being threatened by someone....don’t act like your going to kick me off a discussion topic because I was discussing...um hello kid...that’s what forums are...I in no way attempted to "belittle you" if you look back I did nothing more then what you did....actually you know what I think you went a little further...I cant see why you would think me defending Grand AMs have anything to do with you...ya I care to type huge statements ummm I think its because im a Grand AM owner...they have a better suspension on them...and I do think this topic is called 04 Grand am 2.2 wow that’s what I have....so now I wonder...hmmm why would I care so much when some one says cavi's are better...when they clearly are not... you may know about inertia but do you know about physics....of cores you are going to see results if you try to stuff all this air into a motor...duh! however like I stated b-4 if you want to discuss what is better you need to look at details not results...ya he ran 13's in a 15 attempts...he should....my point is...if he had done it right with the $$ he spent he should be rokin the 12's or 11's...how do I know how much money he spent well we are talking about bolt on's...so please don’t put that in quotes....I don’t know if you know what "giving the right information" is called....but when some one such as your self gives out false information expect to be corrected...then when you are corrected don’t go and act like your still right...that’s insulting….and the definition of a kid...then you did it again...do you know what forums are? this is a place to discuss....if you do not like to discuss things do not post...and please...please dont be incharge of one...this is a promise if you delete me from this post for speaking the truth and correcting your statements....it will not stop...im not saying this in an attempt to be big and scary...I will work hard at it....trust me you don’t know me man...you don’t know my views and who I am...so step back with your redneck views....I am doing what I choose…if you don’t like to get insulated then don’t be arrogant in thinking your right...ya people like bolt on's but that doesn’t mean its the right way to go...REMEMBER this is a Grand am topic...GRAND AM....don’t threaten me...I go to the same events you do...I have read all your posts....don’t think you can take something away from me cause you have the power...that just results in nothing but anger...and I think vie said it enough…its about the torsion bar…not the supercharger….and are you saying my GA is not a high profile car…I think I would spank you in any AUTO you drive….and I would say that GXP also….and who are you to say what should be argued or not....im not the one who made insulting comments 1st remember that....


167,000 on an Ecotec since 02

and i would like to add...b-4 this is locked....in case you can not understand....you said cavi's are better when you told someone to get a cavi and throw a supercharger on it...that is not the smartest way to go...esp if you like the warranties....dont get mad when you get corrected...


167,000 on an Ecotec since 02

NJHK wrote:

Josh Long wrote:1 who likes dealerships?
2 who likes kits?
Not I said the kid with the 5 speed Grand Am.

Ok...and thats you.

Your dislike for dealerships in general is kind of flawed. There are plenty of good dealerships out there, everyone is different because they are independent in how they are operated or how well they operate.

It just depends on the person.

But no offense, you said it yourself, "kid". Some people just want something that is a good deal and less headache so they can go about their life without worrying about if something is going to happen every week.

well i think there was offence...i dont see anyone calling you a kid....why did you feel the need to call kakes one...then procede to do exactly what a KID does...


167,000 on an Ecotec since 02

if anything i think you are the one who need to appoligse.....


167,000 on an Ecotec since 02